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guide author Steve Bourie interviews Colin Jones who with his
partner Ben Crawford ran a blackjack card counting team that
won more than three million dollars during its four-year existence the team was especially unique because
consisted almost entirely of Christians and some other teams exploits were
filmed for a documentary called holy rollers the true story of card
counting christians are going to start off by showing you
the trailer for the movie and that will be followed by Steves
interview with Colin we hope you enjoy it I was really excited when I heard about blank check all Christians it’s
ridiculous it doesn’t seem like when the most noble
things a person can do in the world but least we can liberate money from the
clutches at those who would use it for real purposes him and that’s a start so far in the left-field it might be a professional blackjack
player let alone have a whole team and the fact that everyone new women
ministry instance or with just awesome I knew that they were
good godly people who cared about Jesus cared about integrity and cared about me
that’s what are the main reasons every time that I going see no I was
praying CAF bless me you know those two things
going together never gets old thing about by someone in
here Campbell product of when we look at a casino pretty much
everyone stops and watches us play we’re dealing with betting hands and when im losing hundreds of thousands
of dollars lovers 111 thousand dollars month every once in a while you get people
that are taking extra pride in their job it
finding out that your card Connor yeah he’s gonna get back up tonight I’ve
seen enough the thread back review try to intimidate
you human trying to find pic it the nature of our faces we got
the money if you’ve got the money summers are trying to take I think they’ve been the most creative
team changing appearance and the extra effort to spark theatrics
think that’s about exclusive treat filed so I love the idea the camouflage in you
know kinda you’re doing something this Ron Tom like that makes people reassess
workers this in a good we will have a great because the great you’ve got a question
you are watching anyone who’s here’s the one yes I believe Jesus
should learn blackjack God is calling me and he knows exactly
when and where the current surge on them how did you and Ben first me I’ll we can’t really remember but it was
either a bible camp that we grew up going to together or a church youth
group something like that and what got you interested in blackjack
and Karen Cox yeah um as the story goes now a bed and some friends are getting the
poker and then he had a book called on how to make a million dollars a
hundred thousand dollars a year gambling something like that read a
chapter in a I wanna chapters on card counting in pot I could do that and he told me about it
and I hated just got a math degree and I but I can I
do that too and we said well let’s give it a try and am that I got into it so you guys started
the team initially it was just you two yeah initially I we’re playing
separately I and then you know it’s kinda lonely
job and there’s a million questions are hard
to get answered when you’re starting out and so we’re
talking on the phone constantly on about it and we decided I actually he was he was very briefly part
of the major blackjack team and he did really enjoy a working with then we thought well let’s
just our money together and play and pretty quickly a third friend of
ours and they had a lot more money we had a very smart bankroll he got
involved and the three of us played for a while I’m and then a fourth got a mother we actually met here at a
little kinda bumped into I’m where plan on each other’s tables in
into a scuffle turned into s us becoming friends and working it nice
couple but arguing over jumping into each other’s table turned
into it became friends in performance did that for on maybe couple years an that’s how we started well how did you
learn to form a card counting team and and then why did you choose only
christians well on we we figured it out as we went along you know on we at one point we got a hold of the
Highlanders manual but that was a really helpful
because in a can have to figure things out
yourself anyway and we and Eunos a lot Rohner and constantly
talking about how to motivate everybody how to train
players how to on how to deal with that issues that
honesty and quality of play just all those
things on and then after after a couple years the
for a bus stop playing together and that’s when ben and I start another team in the he actually
you know it was people friends of ours from church they were asking if we would
teach them how to play in it it wasn’t all Christians I was in our
goal a it was probably eighty percent the people on
the team were Christians and that’s what gave a
candidate interesting angle for the documentary but it never was never was our goal nor was
it ever all Christians okay well sent you
did have a lot of Christians on the team then and and did any of them have a
moral objection to gambling in a casino well they wanna join the team if they
would have had a moral objection to being in casinos I am I think a lot of
people at an objection I mean name is a semantics will appeal
an objection to gambling but they the way we sought ways it was investing
I am and that there were lot of Christians
they had objection what we’re doing but the way we saw it was a it wasn’t
immoral how many people are on the team when you
first started her a well to ben and I and then we trained one guy and that
turned into him telling another guy that was a good friend in and it grew from there it we didn’t have
to go love having a large team it just kind of as we’re
winning more and as people told people and i got exciting it just kinda grew in Telugu got to
unhealthy point and then we had to start shrinking well how many people have any members
did have its biggest point I’m over 30 on less than 40 I it’s hard to know I I don’t really remember remember how
many were tested out all at one time and playing
their people training built test it out yeah K how did you get the money to bankroll
your blackjack team I friends and family invested in the team
we we use our own money for years for
probably four years we just use our own money and as a team got large larger we thought we had more than a black
checking mech said a business model it was worth protecting meaning when I
was just a blackjack team I’m worse case scenario we lost our
money and we’re okay with that am but when it became something where if
we went on a bad losing streak people would have to stop working for us
we thought that was worth protecting so we open it up for the first time to family and friends that had been asking
for years hey can I for some money into that and we open it up to people said here’s
the terms will offer and and we let friends and family invest
in it K where you always successful I no I mean no we weren’t always
successful you can see in the documentary huge we went on a 465,000 I losing
streak out at one point I’m we never we never had a losing year
I am we had a winning year all maybe eight or
nine years though that we played by some years there was
very little winnings other years there with you now well over a million dollars one in here
and what was your best winning day me personally or teen hi I guess the
team a I don’t really know our best winning day
because we on we had players send in their results
once a week because we didn’t get bombarded with result constantly but I do remember a
guy winning a hundred thousand that one
casino in a day on the and at I don’t know I really remember beyond
here a mocha how bout you per person I what
was your best wedding day and I one about fifty thousand dollars
and one day one time in the middle of nowhere
USA and what was your worst losing day I my first the first day I was ever in Las
Vegas I lost about forty thousand dollars and got backed off from all MGM
properties in a bit in the course about three hours I lost forty thousand with all our time
to play in any MGM properties and thought I was that was a pretty rough first day in
Vegas and how many times are you ask or told to leave a casino for Canon
carts I I’ve never kept track the how many
cases have been asked not to play and Mike guess is it’s over 50 ill left then a hundred and 50 its broader yeah I am where you ever forcefully removed a back
room yeah I’ve been back room what was it like to be back room yeah and we went on a trip this is our for
our previous team on this when I played a live a the 4s
went to Arizona and we played there for about
six days and at the end of the six days we had
240,000 and chips 21 casino because we’ve been just winning like
crazy we pride bodin 60,000 there and one eighty thousand so we had all
these chips and one with that one guy to catch them all out
even though all for Vista been playing is a bad idea so we sent him with all the chips and
after about I half an hour we hadn’t heard from him
so we sent another guy and their to go find out what was going on and
after another half hour the last to have ice decide to go in there to find out what
was going on and it ended up in all for this being in the
downstairs room at the casino with a handful have
security guards and men in suits and they they asses how we had cheated
them for that much money and we spent about an hour explaining
there wasn’t cheating is card counting and how card king worked
in the past how we knew how how to play and we said there’s a
million bucks I they ask how we know how much did that and we i do explain to them our bet
spread and how it works that was the only way they’re willing to cassius out so then they took us cashed
out are hundred and forty thousand dollars and that said we weren’t allowed in
there again but I i’ve been that I’ve been hank up
to a casino at had to explain to the police
that I was only card counting even okay
because he knows that I was doing something illegal explained it and by the end of that altercation with
that police officer he was asking for their our website address so we can teach him
how to count cards can you explain what the Griffin book is
and do you know if you’re in it that Griffin book is it’s now an online database a card counters and cheaters
and undesirables I’m and yes I and i’ve seen I’m a great
fan page I have my I OS an organ surveillance network page
at can this from from friends that have got them from
friend that got them from somewhat someone I the Griffin agency I isn’t a very big deal anymore now I
guess organ surveillance network and sian Sen that biometrika San network those
are larger yeah I i’ve been in those senses very
early on I made a mistake a casino told me I had to give them my ID I was
scared 22 years old and said okay and then found out there
lying to me photocopied it said it in the graph and I’ve been in Griffin ever
send am but that haven’t really slow down my
career never that never did and how did you
initially trainer came in members well we we first I first decided train a few
friends and I they were very bright just so they could spot for me on and through that we got better at
training people I’m we learned what not to do and over
time we got really get it just systematically training people from the
ground up because our network at people most of them had never been in a casino
or if they’ve been a casino they definitely had played much
blackjack 30 taking people and say okay this is
blackjack this is how the rules work this is a play basic Shaji this is how
you count cards this is how you do it that spread he’s a
deviation you know just we learn kinda process of taking people from the ground up I’m just through
through a lot of time in a actually loaded just how good
businesses are run they have a very well oiled machine training people I laughter trained on when did you know
they were ready to play for real money yeah we had on both at home and at
Casino test out process we would be other
people at home and they had to play through a certain number shoes perfectly without
any mistakes and when they had done that then they
were allowed to do in in casino test and that was a very similar process
would sit there we watched them play and if they made a
single mistake or even if they made us feel not
comfortable handing I’m t-money then they would go practice some
more and and tell they could really you know
impressed us that besides winning what was the best
part about running a car County the best part about running at the blackjack team really for us it
was a it was a lot of very fine cool people II so
he’s joking we pride on at the most successful blackjack team but we gotta have the most fun because
the people involved I am you know it’s kinda like when
there’s time of your life sort things out I don’t think I could I think I could do
it again I don’t know if I would because it was just really a fun experience back then and on I was a great network
if people and every day user everybody enjoyed being a part of
it for those fiber so years well what was the
worst part about running the team the worst part about running the team
was having a fire friends but you know that a that’s right now is
rough but I learned a lot about his business and immaturity in friendship
and and the fact that we’re still friends %uh you now other people now we had a fire I
saw consider them friends they consider me a friend that was rather on other than that losing streak to just brutal you don’t
know if you’re making a mistake ur or I don’t know if they’re making
because I can’t watch every and played by the players and likely showing the documentary you
can tell people are pocketing money or not I so when you’re winning you never think
about those things when you’re losing you’re wondering is this chest that lack
or his something more okay let’s take it
one step further didn’t do you think there ever was cheating on the team I yeah iron I think that I think that there’s a
decent chance at some point people I violated are player agreement it’s really hard to
know whether it’s it’s more that kinda white-collar crime
like being sloppy with I’m when they clocked
out so to speak or whether it was deeper like someone
dropped five or ten thousand dollars and thought
I can’t afford to pay that back to the team and just kinda rolled into the results and just knowing that link the time we ran the team and
just knowing human nature I I’d say it probably odds are probably happened we always say
that with well as in other a risk but it
seemed like we had two options either not run a black TechTeam or try their
lower that risk as much as humanly possible and hope for the best again and why did
you break up the team and basically after when ben and I started that the team the
show the documentary that the larger scale team we thought hey this seems worth doing
for a year to on and pretty quickly with that wow I wonder if we can run this thing
for five years and try to have you now an exit strategy
before before then and and was really fun for three or four five years on after a
while it started to feel more like a grind and
start to realize that’s not it that’s going to be a
really difficult career and other I know the Highlanders you know then
they get a free for many years and all other ally the other there our people that
it’s a career but it was never a career goal for us on that combined with an a lot of allow the people on the team
I’m we ended up having a buncha kids
something and I don’t know if I feel like find around the country every weekend
cell on yeah and that we never won as much money the the last few years as kinda will we
just I think we just you know how to little
bit the hot streak at the beginning and and after after enough years is we’re
still making money but it wasn’t a on I said we had other goals in life and
by well unless we’re gonna run a
large-scale team on maybe we’ll try you know move another we’re moving in
that we start by checking pressure in the height of their black tech team because we’re just
interested in trying other things and working on other businesses okay if
there’s a 1% misconception the public has about
blackjack what would you say it is her one misconception people about
blackjack either the car gangs illegal or probably
the bigger one is is people think that they that they have
a system to beat the game outsider card-carrying am you now I’ve met a
million people say oh I’ve gotta I’ve got a way to be black jacket and a
there there’s it’s got to be a very Keckley Matt
Mackall at tonight following your gather you know anything like that but I think
a lotta am allowed gambling is bill built on the
idea that oh there’s a way to there’s an angle that I can I can figure
out on the town and looking back on it what would you
have done differently I looking back over by clicking there’s
prior lot I think that would have than differently on I think ever we were 23 24 year olds running a million million a half dollar
business so we didn’t know what we’re doing but I think the biggest
thing was on having higher standards for player players and realizing also why it kinda person is actually an excel at the job
you can teach a lot people by a why people get burned out really
quick and the third difficult difficult job okay and what you doing nowadays Iran blackjack pressure dot com and I’ve
I’ve started a handful of other web sites with friends or or on my own better on you know that’s both Ben and I moved into other mostly website on thats main thing I spend my time working
on right how can people find out more about you when you work bill can visit our website blackjack
pressure dot com thats thats our goal is to have
everything people need to learn how to be blackjack card counting and have a
community repeal can network with others and and a train and find out more about which casinos to play now play don’t
forget that you can see more of our educational gaming videos on our YouTube
channel just go to youtube.com/americancasinoguide




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